surrender...
here or elsewhere...

Wednesday July 02nd 2008 10:25:35 AM
Burlington Bertie: Monday night was perfect in every way. Intimate and perfect. The most moving and touching live performance I have ever seen. The voice broke only once, that at the beginning, "Everything is for ..." Nothing comes close to the high I left this gig with. Thanks to all.
Thursday June 19th 2008 02:59:29 PM
tesy:
Monday June 02nd 2008 12:21:48 PM | [ link ]
perceiving_the_present: Laymar,Tenebrous Liar & very special guests Cindytalk Monday 30th June,The 12 Bar,Denmark Street London WC2."This rare live performance by Cindytalk, will feature two live sets in one. An abstract and minimal electronic set will intermingle with a partly improvised set of new material by a full band line-up, featuring singer Gordon Sharp alongside long-time Cindytalk drummer Paul Middleton, bass monster Gary Jeff, laptop obscurist Sherrill Crosby and new guitarist Daniel Knowler."
Thursday May 08th 2008 03:21:16 AM
Cindy: Matt,You asked me for a shaman to help you on your way... this was written some time ago but maybe i can imagine you near and i'm whispering in your ear......... this journey is fevered and i'm moving between the lines in a corner of the sky where it's dark around the edges,where pity holds sway.i'm trying to stay dry for now,hot then cold, i'm slipping in and out of focus.at times i hover then i'm still,maybe for days.and then like now i'm falling,flying,swooping...like the golden eagle i can see all things from this vantage point.i hear you sigh,lost in that distance,of warm bodies,of silver shoals of light.of flying too... it's never cold up here,even when it's snows,even when i'm naked. and you on the edge of adventure,close your eyes, close your eyes,close your eyes... we're falling, flying,swooping... touching wings like the inuits kiss.up up up into the cool blue sky,caressing... i change my name from icarus to shaman ghost- echoes and take my place at the mouth of every river,dancing with the wind,with the moon,with the love of a million stars.embrace... and when you reach that edge and a long long long way down, close your eyes,close your eyes,close your eyes and feel the ghost echoes...
Thursday May 08th 2008 03:15:44 AM
Cindy: Both Hands Turn To Heaven (Matt Kinnison RIP)... Long-time Cindytalk friend and collaborator,Matt Kinnison,died on wednesday 7th of May.Matt who had been part of the Cindytalk family since 1982 (having co-written "Under Glass" from the Camouflage Heart album) had been ill with cancer for some time.He died peacefully at around 11am after deciding he had endured enough.I saw him a few hours earlier and let him know that his spirit would continue to shine through all of our future work.And whilst it was very difficult to see him so close to death,he had almost never looked more beautiful.It was an absolute privilege to spend that time with him.He told me he was 16 when he came to audition for Cindytalk (when David Clancy and I lived up in East Finchley in 1982) but we subsequently discovered he'd lied and was only 15.I thought he was too young to be considered as our bass-player at that time but had a strong feeling that here was somebody very very special, somebody that would get better and more interesting through time.He proved me right and more.He wasn't always the easiest person to work with,he didn't just have foibles he had FOIBLES... but he was more than worth any effort made and he showed that time and time again,especially with his bass-playing and tape manipulations on "The Wind Is Strong" & "Wappinschaw".We had been in rehearsal to play live when he had to stop due to a shoulder problem which was later diagnosed as lung cancer.We had also been working together on new material over the last two years,notably, "For The Benefit Of All" and "Silver Shoals Of Light",both of which were written by myself and Matt.A new Cindytalk album, again written between Matt and I ("Hold Everything Dear") had just been completed before Matt's condition worsened,rendering him unable to create any new sounds.Cindytalk label touchedRAW had been planning to release Matt's stunning album of yayli tambur pieces "Evenings Of Ordinary Sand" but had been held up due to the petty deception of our back catalogue being stolen.But we will endeavour to bring that plan to fruition as soon as possible.Matt always worked very hard with his music and he did so right up to the end.He will be sadly missed by all those he came in contact with.Rest in Peace Matt,seek out those corners,wherever you are.You will always be with us.We love you.
Thursday April 03rd 2008 11:24:59 AM
storms&blizzards: Bluesanct Update: "So here is another update on the CINDYTALK 10" out soon on Bluesanct.Most importantly, WE HAVE THE VINYL! and goodness is it pretty and it sounds FIERCE! I was on tour with a friend for all of February, during which time I had hoped to have the b-side of the vinyl screenprinted with the image Gordon gave me... unfortunately, the image was too detailed to work out, and so we are looking into other ideas for the screenprint, hence the delay.In the meantime, I hope to sort out the sleeve this weekend, and shoot it off to the printers...AND SO...We are making slow, but sure, progress... I will update everyone again soon, with pre-order info and a price, so you can be the first in line and be sure to get a copy of this gorgeous piece of sound and vision by CINDYTALK! All good things...Mkl."
Thursday March 27th 2008 02:35:08 AM
dizzied: Regarding the influence of "Loveless" & "Spirit Of Eden", My Bloody Valentine and Talk Talk were media darlings,something Cindytalk have never been and i doubt that'll change any time soon... the thought of Cindytalk being used on shitty soundtracks like "Lost In Translation" (shitty film too) is just too horrible to contemplate.some music needs to inhabit a shadow world,it's all the better for it.
Wednesday March 26th 2008 12:32:42 PM | [ link ]
kazami: Long-time Cindytalk fan Cheggers/Noise is a Friend says:"Camouflage Heart", ... well, this is one of my favourite albums ever, and it was shocking that, although knowing that a re-issue was imminent, its release slipped by me at the end of last year without me noticing.Having now rectified this error, "Camouflage Heart" still sounds fantastic - brutal, charging, intense, threatening, beautiful, the darkest record of its time... and one of the most astonishing and gorgeous sounds ever recorded: the haunting sweep of strummed piano during the closing "Disintegrate..." I¡Çm awaiting the re-issue of "In This World", but for now I¡Çm glad that Cindytalk are back in the forefront of my musical experience... I absolutely adore both In This World records, some I'm hotly anticipating hearing the re- masters -so many people talk about the influence that records like "Loveless" and "Spirit of Eden" have had in recent years (and I love those 2 LPs as well), but I'd say that Cindytalk were there first with the overwhelming walls of sound and the introspective emptiness ... and with new music to come, the world is a more fascinating place again."
Wednesday March 26th 2008 03:50:26 AM | [ link ]
tinkerette: New tunes to flow with available from touchedRAW.Follow the link steps...
Monday March 17th 2008 06:15:18 AM
kazami: But they forget to mention anything to the band... :-(
Monday March 17th 2008 05:14:55 AM | [ link ]
chigisakh: French magazine Elegy contains a Cindytalk article/review AND the track "It's Luxury" in an accompanying sampler.They do not mention Alaska ...
Monday March 17th 2008 04:55:57 AM
williwaw: A French online record shop says : "Cindy Talks was one of those strange band from the 80's (this one originally issued in 1984)... Coming from Alaska, they provide a unique melt of ambient industrial Cold wave."... ALASKA???!!! Information meltdown rather!
Wednesday March 12th 2008 12:26:17 PM | [ link ]
plover: San Francisco's Aquarius Records lists Cindytalk reissues in their "Highlights of the months" section saying:"As Cindytalk had suffered through the fate of several record companies going out of business (first Midnight Records then World Serpent), their work might have been forgotten had it not been for this reissue. Thankfully, that oversight can now be remedies with this long overdue reissue"...
Saturday February 02nd 2008 05:15:43 PM | [ link ]
second_treasure: Short trailer for WE DISAPPEAR,the third novel by Scott Heim. It is published in paperback by HarperPerennial, and will arrive in bookstores on February 26th. This trailer for the book provides the atmosphere for this psychological thriller about obsession, addiction, and loss, a book that should please fans of Heim's earlier MYSTERIOUS SKIN (which was adapted for a 2005 film by director Gregg Araki). Accompanying music by Cindytalk.
Wednesday January 30th 2008 08:48:45 AM | [ link ]
Cloudlet: A CINDYTALK REMIX From Susan Matthews site:"Gordon Sharp of Cindytalk has created a stunning remix of 'Veiled' for Susan's upcoming remix project MOTION.SILENCE.ECHO. The mix was premiered last night (Nov 30th) in London during a LapTop set by the man himself and will also be featured in a second LapTop set later this month (23rd December) in Shanghai."
Monday January 28th 2008 10:24:06 AM
Scarborian: It's woonderful to see David's stuff up on YouTube it gave me a very pleasant afternoon. Some songs I'd never heard, others, versions I'd never heard. Thank you David.
Monday January 28th 2008 09:21:51 AM | [ link ]
spaewaif: David Clancy,member&co-founder of The Freeze and Cindytalk,recently started a project on youtube to highlight the band's early work.The clips contain many rarities and David's comments are always a joy to read.An excellent idea!
Monday January 28th 2008 08:51:12 AM | [ link ]
SwallowGarden: Enjoy this Cindytalk quiz that Plastic Orcadian,aka Scarborian,created a while ago...
Wednesday January 23rd 2008 04:45:59 PM | [ link ]
TheMadDaySparkles: The Trinity webzine interview is now available in English at "Of Ghosts and Buildings".
Tuesday January 22nd 2008 02:02:15 AM
cndr: the second track is in fact called "surrounded by sky and the stillness of time".it's just one track, although it did start out as two seperate pieces ;-)
Monday January 21st 2008 04:09:09 PM
waterborne reverie: BTW,Trinity will soon release a 10th anniversary compilation CD titled "Ruines and Vanites" to which Cindytalk contribute two tracks:"Canto" and "Surrounded by Sky/The Stillness of Time".The CD comes in an edition limited to 500 copies of which the first hundred are especially numbered and contain inserts.
Monday January 21st 2008 03:48:48 PM
waterborne reverie: BTW,Trinity will soon release a 10th anniversary compilation CD titled "Ruines and Vanites" to which Cindytalk contribute two tracks:"Canto" and "Surrounded by Sky/The Stillness of Time".The CD comes in an edition limited to 500 copies of which the first hundred are especially numbered and contain inserts.
Monday January 21st 2008 03:38:56 PM | [ link ]
everlasting: Cinder-interview ,in French...
Wednesday December 19th 2007 08:46:50 PM
silver anticipation: i'm so fucking excited about this 10" slab of vinyl that it feels like electricity shooting from my fingertips just imagining when i'll hold in my hands let alone putting a needle to the groove. yipyip!
Wednesday December 19th 2007 11:10:16 AM
silver_banner: From Bluesanct:Greetings from Bloomington, Indiana! This is an update on the progress for the CINDYTALK 10". The vinyl has been mastered direct to lacquer at Golden Mastering (who were wonderful to work with), and it currently at the record plant. Test pressings and labels are being made right now. I hope to have the vinyl soon after New Years, keeping us on schedule for a hopeful FEB 08 release. Once the vinyl is in hand, I will begin the process of arranging to have them screenprinted locally by a friend of mine. As well as the process of having the covers printed by a friend in Chicago. Once I have quotes on both those portions, I will be able to figure out the cost for the entire project, and come up with a price to sell them at. At that point, I will email you all again with info on how to pre-order the single. It's going to be GORGEOUS! Wait until you see this thing... wow! I would like ot thank Gordon and the band for letting me release this single. I hope to work with them again and again, and have dreamed of such since I first heard 'In This World' in 1987. Silver Shoals of Light. Mkl.
Sunday December 16th 2007 09:58:06 AM | [ link ]
Saltwater Sisters: Interview with Eagleton in today's Guardian/Observer:"The Armchair Revolutionary".
Tuesday December 04th 2007 11:34:42 AM
"Girls' breath,violet holds": On Dec 23rd,Cindytalk will be playing a laptop set in Shanghai.Also playing will be Japanese/Korean 10 and Chinese Torturing Nurse.Venue:Yu Yin Tang.
Tuesday December 04th 2007 11:23:34 AM | [ link ]
"dust smells of a sun-ray": Last Friday,Cindytalk (Cinder&Shrill on this occasion) played a laptop/voice set in Leytonstone.Some pics in Ghosts.
Tuesday November 27th 2007 12:54:42 AM
silver surfer: what happened to "ice on our tracks"?
Saturday November 24th 2007 01:27:55 PM
forgetful: You never know,you never know... ;-)
Saturday November 24th 2007 11:56:59 AM
Scarborian: Oh dear, did you mark the spot where you dropped it, in case it's worth picking up again one day?
Friday November 23rd 2007 04:59:58 PM
Scarborian ExPO: Let us very much hope so
Friday November 23rd 2007 02:56:17 PM
oh,I dropped something!: .
Friday November 23rd 2007 02:55:12 PM
expo2008: Hmm,just wondering..Is Plastic Orcadian a thing of the past?
Thursday November 22nd 2007 05:00:50 PM | [ link ]
Scarborian: I got a warm glow today when listening to Fingers and Toes on the My Space site. I noticed the words Teu Neems wToby Reynolds. A Teu Neem is the nickname given to inhabitants of an Orkney district, I hope I can share that. I listened at the keyhole to this recording being made and that moment will remain with me forever, to hear such a beautiful song being born was very special.
Tuesday November 20th 2007 03:46:19 AM
do not swallow: Ronan Bennett Monday November 19, 2007 The Guardian What do you make of the following statement: "Asians are gaining on us demographically at a huge rate. A quarter of humanity now and by 2025 they'll be a third. Italy's down to 1.1 child per woman. We're just going to be outnumbered." While we're at it, what do you think of this, incidentally from the same speaker: "The Black community will have to suffer until it gets its house in order." Or this, the same speaker again: "I just don't hear from moderate Judaism, do you?" And (yes, same speaker): "Strip-searching Irish people. Discriminatory stuff, until it hurts the whole Irish community and they start getting tough with their children." The speaker was Martin Amis and, yes, the quotations have been modified, with Asians, Blacks and Irish here substituted for Muslims, and Judaism for Islam - though, it should be stressed, these are the only amendments. Terry Eagleton, professor of English literature at Manchester University, where Amis has also started to teach, recently quoted the remarks in a new edition of his book Ideology: An Introduction. Amis, Eagleton claimed, was advocating nothing less than the "hounding and humiliation" of Muslims so "they would return home and teach their children to be obedient to the White Man's law". The heated exchanges that followed were trivialised in the mainstream media as "a nasty literary punch- up", "the talk of the literary world", "a spat" between "two warring professors", and the silence that followed seemed to confirm it as a passing tiff between two high-ranking members of the chattering class. I see it differently. Amis's views are symptomatic of a much wider and deeper hostility to Islam and intolerance of otherness. Only last week, the London Evening Standard felt able to sponsor a debate entitled: Is Islam good for London? Do another substitution here and imagine the reaction had Judaism been the subject. As Rabbi Pete Tobias noted on Comment is Free, the so-called debate was sinisterly reminiscent of the paper's campaign a century ago to alert its readers to the "problem of the alien", namely the eastern European Jews fleeing persecution who had found refuge in the capital. In this context, Rod Liddle's contribution to proceedings - "Islamophobia? Count me in" - sounds neither brave, brash nor provocatively outrageous, merely racist. Those who claim that Islamophobia can't be racist, because Islam is a religion not a race, are fooling themselves: religion is not only about faith but also about identity, background and culture, and Muslims are overwhelmingly non-white. Islamophobia is racist, and so is antisemitism. And it is different for another reason. The views quoted by Eagleton first appeared last year, in an interview Amis gave to Ginny Dougary of the Times. That they passed with virtually no comment at the time says a great deal about the depoliticised state of intellectual debate in Britain. While a great deal of media time and energy is spent discussing the latest translation of War and Peace or the artwork in the refurbished St Pancras station, there has been, with a few notable exceptions, a puzzling lack of effort when it comes to something as critical as expressing support for an increasingly demonised minority in our society. Martin Amis should have been taken to task by his peers for his views. He was not. This is all the more remarkable when you look closely at what Amis has been saying about Muslims and Islam. To the Dougary interview first. Eagleton drew particular attention to a passage that argued for collective punishment: "The Muslim community will have to suffer until it gets its house in order. What sort of suffering? Not let them travel. Deportation - further down the road. Curtailing of freedoms. Strip-searching people who look like they're from the Middle East or from Pakistan ... Discriminatory stuff, until it hurts the whole community and they start getting tough with their children." Amis sought to excuse the passage quoted above by pointing out that it was prefaced by the words "There's a definite urge - don't you have it? - to say, 'The Muslim community ... (etc)'." And he repeatedly highlighted the fact that the comments were spoken, not written, as Eagleton wrongly claimed (which, in some degree, allowed Amis to dodge the central charge of Islamophobia). In a letter to the Independent columnist Yasmin Alibhai- Brown, he explained, "It was a thought experiment, or a mood experiment." He had not "advocated" anti-Muslim measures, "merely adumbrated" them. If, for some, the distinction was not quite clear, Amis expanded his defence in a live interview with Jon Snow on Channel 4 News. He maintained that the target of his attack was Islamism, "an extreme ideology within a religion". He was not, he stressed, attacking Islam itself or Muslims in general, though he ran into some difficulty when Snow reminded him of his observation on the alleged "extreme incuriosity of Islamic culture", and of his reaction on seeing his six-year-old daughter's toys being searched by airport security: "Oh yeah, and stick to people who look like they're from the Middle East" (itself further proof, if such were needed, of the racist nature of Islamophobia). Taken along with his assertion that "there are great problems in Islam", did not these statements, Snow proposed, indicate that he was taking "scattergun" aim at all Muslims? Amis retorted: "I do not believe in any persecution of the Muslim community. I think that would be counterproductive." At which point, the question becomes unavoidable: is efficacy now to be the benchmark for persecutors? He also confessed to "little impulses, urges and atavisms now and then", which was uncomfortably like a collusive wink to the audience: we all have our little prejudices, don't we? Though he was forced to squirm a little, Amis refused to recant or apologise. His demeanour throughout was the ostentatious weariness of the unfairly traduced, and he called for an end to the whole dull business. "Can I ask him [Eagleton], in a collegial spirit, to shut up about it?" he wrote in a letter to this newspaper. Do we let the homophobe off the hook just because he tells his critics to shut up? Do we pass over the rantings of the antisemite just because he did not commit the poison to the page? To judge from the response of most liberal commentators, the defence seemed to work, and Amis's wish to have a line drawn under the affair was granted. While Eagleton was attacked as a clapped-out marxist, Amis was commended, by a writer in the Observer, for "owning up - bravely, as it turned out - to what amounted to a revenge fantasy". His "thought experiment" was the incautious but challenging musing of one of the most vivid and verbally energetic modern writers in English. In the Guardian, one writer concluded that although he was often irritating, Amis had raised important questions, while among the rhetorical questions asked by Professor John Sutherland was whether Eagleton's - Eagleton's! - position at Manchester University was tenable after labelling a colleague a bigot and a racist. We can dispense with Amis's polite fiction that he is talking about "Islamism"; there are just too many generalisations ("The impulse towards rational inquiry," Amis wrote elsewhere, "is by now very weak in the rank and file of the Muslim male"), too many references to "them" and "us". When he says, for example, "they" are gaining on "us" demographically, he is demonstrably not talking about "Islamists". The danger of being overrun, outnumbered, outbred is a repugnant trope beloved of supremacists everywhere (it was used by the Evening Standard about "aliens" 100 years ago). It is, for example, horribly familiar to Arab Israelis, and to Irish Catholics (from whom Eagleton is descended). When Amis voices his fears of being overrun, he is, and he knows he is, perpetuating and enhancing the spectre of the other, and loading it with the potent imagery of swarming poverty, violence and ignorance. At the Cheltenham literary festival, Amis treated his audience to a discussion on the relative value of Muslim and western states, the former being, in his estimation, less evolved than the latter. "I am just saying that some societies are more evolved than others," he said. (Evolved is an interesting choice of word. In the Belgian Congo, the colonisers used to employ a system of rewarding colonised people who alienated themselves from indigenous society: they were raised to an officially designated category of évolués.) "There is no inoffensive way to put this," Amis continued provocatively. "By evolved, I mean more civilised. We have more respect for civil society." This is not the time or place to debate the proposition or the definitions Amis employs, though I would say, in a general response to the generalised argument, that I have seen, at times, rather more respect for civil society, from how they treat their families and the elderly to strangers in the street, in Damascus, Ramallah and east Jerusalem than I have seen, at times, in London, New York and Paris. Equally, when he says, "Here in the west we have the most evolved society in the world and we are not blowing people up", it is hard not to think of the ghosts of tens of thousands, if not hundreds of thousands, of Muslim dead from Iraq to Afghanistan who might take issue with him. No, here the salient point is that Amis, contrary to his assertions, is talking about Islam, not Islamism, Muslims, not Islamists. It is one thing - and the right thing - to challenge at every turn antisemitism, misogyny, homophobia, incitement to violence and hatred where it exists among Muslims, just as we should where it exists in the police, the church, the political parties, newspapers or anywhere else. But British Muslims I have spoken to now talk about feeling "deluged" by hostile comment. Hardly a day goes past when they are not lectured and scolded by writers claiming to be the champions of true liberalism. Muslims who argue for Muslim schools are criticised by journalists who send their children to Christian or Jewish faith schools. Muslim women who choose to wear the niqab are upbraided by powerful politicians who claim to feel "intimidated". Those who point to the illegality of Israeli occupation are antisemites. Those who protest against the war in Iraq are al-Qaida sympathisers and moral relativists. Muslims are under siege. Worried that if they speak out they will be accused of being quasi- Islamist, many have given up trying to engage in the debate over what Amis calls "the problems of Islam" (our old friend the "problem of the alien" again). This is a community under attack, and not just by novelists. By every official index, violence and discrimination against Muslims have increased since 2001. The victims of physical violence will always be a minority - although Asian people are twice as likely to be stabbed to death than they were ten years ago - but what the majority experience in their daily lives is much more insidious, the kind of coded rejection that in this more enlightened age takes the place of outright expressions of racism. And, of course, hanging over them are threats of control orders, curfews, arrest and extended periods of detention without trial. Just as the 1974 Prevention of Terrorism Act left the Irish community in Britain feeling like a suspect nation, so the infinitely more repressive anti- terrorist legislation - including 28 days' detention without charge rather than the old seven when the IRA were active - of today intimidates, alienates and inflames Muslims. Muslims bridle at the broad strokes by which they are depicted. Every time a writer or politician or policeman begins a sentence by saying "Muslims must ...", there is little recognition of the sheer variety of belief within Islam, or of the cultural diversity among Muslims, or of the everyday pragmatic reality of what it means in a secular age to believe in God and to try to live by that belief. In this respect Muslims are like anyone else. Some are devout, some are not at all, some are not very much, and some are devout sometimes. Some are sinners; they fall down and try to get up again. Some are hypocrites who fall down and pretend to be still on their feet. Many fail to live up to their religion's, and their own, high expectations of themselves. Many have sex outside marriage, as many Catholics do. Some Muslims drink alcohol, as some Jews eat pork. A few, in common with a few Christians, think gay people should be murdered. Observant Muslims contest, dispute, accept and reject points of doctrine exactly as those from other faiths do. The Qur'an, as one Muslim put it to me, is not a program to be loaded and Muslims are not computers. But almost worse than the ignoramus is the self- styled expert. After the attacks on the Pentagon and the twin towers, Tony Blair liked to be seen carrying his copy of the Qur'an, as though this were evidence of a deep understanding. (Not that his Qur'an was much help when he was writing to Pakistan's General Musharraf, at least according to Peter Stothard, observing him at work in Downing Street: "'Dear Pervez ...' says the prime minister, as his pen glides along the top of a letter. 'I'm never quite sure what name to use with Muslims,' he says, looking up at his staff and down dubiously at his handiwork so far." His staff suggested "General".) I can remember a presenter on the Today programme begin her challenge to a Muslim activist with the words, "But the Qur'an says ..." To which her interviewee retorted impatiently, "I'm sick of you people telling me what's Islamic or not. This is my religion and you don't know anything about it." Reading Amis's letter to Alibhai-Brown hardly gives the impression that the author is an authority. Recalling that they once spent a convivial evening together, he said, "That night you revealed ... that you were Shia and, as far as I understand it, the Shia minority speaks for the more dreamy and poetic face of Islam." Is he perhaps confusing Shias with Sufis? The letter itself was a staggering exercise in condescension, its recipient praised as one of the good Muslims in the same way the Belgians kindly patted their évolués on the head. In a separate interview about his fictional reimagining of Mohammed Atta, who piloted the hijacked plane into the first of the twin towers, Amis acknowledged that he took "an enormous liberty in that I made him an apostate, rather than a religious maniac". He said, "It would have bored me blind to look into the mind of someone who was fanatically religious. I make him a cynic who is there just for the killing, and I wanted to emphasise that, that's it's a secret no longer well-kept, that killing people is tremendously empowering and exciting." As a novelist, Amis is free to do whatever he wants with his characters, but the hijackers' steps on the road to 9/11 repay investigation. Reducing the motivation of the enemy to bloodlust leads nowhere, as the experience of the British in Ireland proved. The result will be wrong and it will be cliche. It may be, given Amis's spectacular powers, flamboyant, but that will only make it flamboyant cliche. Horrorism. Death cult. Thanatoid. Striking words but poor substitutes for understanding, reason and real knowledge. Go back to the start of this article. Look at the substitutions and then ask yourself what you are reading. An important question from a leading literary figure? A brave revenge fantasy? No. A major cultural and literary figure endorsing prejudice against Muslims. Why did writers not start writing? There is Eagleton and there is the Indian novelist and essayist Pankaj Mishra, who took apart Amis's strange and chaotic essay on the sixth anniversary of 9/11. But where are the others? Four days after the Pentagon and the twin towers were attacked, the novelist Ian McEwan wrote on these pages: "Imagining what it is like to be someone other than yourself is at the core of our humanity. It is the essence of compassion, and it is the beginning of morality." As an expression of outraged, anguished humanism, McEwan's formulation was truthful, moving and humbling, and can hardly be bettered. But it seems to me the compassion is flowing in one direction, the anger in another. I can't help feeling that Amis's remarks, his defence of them, and the reaction to them were a test. They were a test of our commitment to a society in which imaginative sympathy applies not just to those like us but to those whose lives and beliefs run along different lines. And I can't help feeling we failed that test. Amis got away with it. He got away with as odious an outburst of racist sentiment as any public figure has made in this country for a very long time. Shame on him for saying it, and shame on us for tolerating it.
Tuesday November 13th 2007 02:43:30 PM
-25: doesn't have to mention cindytalk for you to tell us about yer book in these parts.all the best with it.cx.
Monday November 12th 2007 11:38:01 PM | [ link ]
Billy Hunt: Is it okay to do a book plug here. The book does mention Gordon Sharp twice and cindytalk once, so it's maybe not too naughty to use the forum.
Monday November 05th 2007 06:31:28 AM | [ link ]
attack ball: From Susan Matthews website: Also underway is 'Motion.Silence.Echo' featuring a number of artists (Tony Wakeford, Rainier Lericolais, Fabrizio Mondonese Palumbo, Shaun Blezard, Alistair Crosbie, Nick Grey, Cindytalk) who've been invited to remix tracks from Susan's CD releases.
Friday November 02nd 2007 10:21:52 PM
pìobaireachd: i love a good drone now and then but i wouldn't say cindytalk have ever been a drone band.very silly...
Wednesday October 31st 2007 05:35:27 AM
insect-musician: Read somewhere:"CINDYTALK: One of Britainfs longest running drone bands"...Huh?
Monday October 29th 2007 07:42:34 AM | [ link ]
kazami: A beautiful track from the "Orkney Sessions" with Toby Reynolds/DJ Scud and Gordon Sharp,"Ice on Our Tracks",is available for listening in CINdYTALK's myspace music player.
Tuesday October 16th 2007 04:49:12 PM
breakf: Hi spaewaif. How are you ? It was a special night (and week-end) for sure. Poetry indeed as well as warmth and laughs. Next time, "will you join the dance" (like in the Lobster-quadrille) ? close your eyes and pretend Japan isn't so far away ! ;-)
Monday October 15th 2007 10:48:53 AM
spaewaif: I found some that need some work and was thinking of posting them soon in Ghosts together with Fabrice's words.
Monday October 15th 2007 10:10:15 AM
spaewaif: I found some that need some work and was thinking of posting them soon in Ghosts together with Fabrice's words.
Sunday October 14th 2007 10:39:20 AM
awol: Does anyone have pictures or video from the night which could be shared?
Saturday October 13th 2007 06:08:32 AM
spaewaif: Fabrice,your review is beautiful and poetic.Thank you so much for those words.
Thursday October 11th 2007 04:28:51 PM
bedandbreakfast: sat. 29th of september. Night. Cindytalk were caged as birds but still flying. The menagerie exploded with colours and flames. Voice and bass and electronics and drums. Cindy threw shapes like a strange ballet dancer - ghostdance. Oh and she wore a silver version of Dorothy's shoes (Dorothy from Esmerald city of Oz that is). Paul Middleton's bad good jokes (before and after gig) were an absolute plus. Fear quickly became excitement. Dreaming. I was exhausted and definitely in heaven. xo
Wednesday October 10th 2007 11:28:03 AM
drowning: 'silver shoals of light' was written and produced by gordon sharp and matt kinnison.all images on the ARTwork are by spaewaif.
Wednesday October 10th 2007 11:02:49 AM | [ link ]
aflame&fleeting: Bluesanct has now a pre-order page for their CINdYTALK release.
Tuesday October 09th 2007 08:39:53 AM | [ link ]
where skylarks are seen...: News from Bluesanct:"**CINDYTALK - Silver Shoals of Light art 10" (INRI084) The third in our series of art vinyl, ltd to 500 copies w/ screenprinted vinyl and letter-pressed sleeve. Cindytalk are one of the utmost important artists in the experimental community, and since the early 80's have produced some of my favourite albums of all time. I am VERY excited to be issuing this brand new Cindytalk track..." The website also indicates the following: CINDYTALK - Silver Shoals of Light 10" (INRI084) A gorgeous 10" single, w/ screenprinted vinyl and letter-pressed sleeve. A TEN "!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Monday October 08th 2007 08:02:49 AM
burden-of-life: Fabrice,Fabrice!Are you going to tell us about Behind Bars? :-(
Tuesday September 18th 2007 05:29:29 AM
lostandfound: chance for tea.......spelling.
Tuesday September 18th 2007 05:28:29 AM
lostandfound: Gordon, will any unreleased items be on the reissues? This has been along time coming. I remember you mentioning a box set idea several years ago. Make anything from that Freeze EP I gave you back in 2001? I never got a change for tea....you were working with Dale. (we both lived in Seattle) Anyway, look forward to the releases, and reissues too. I must do a better job on keeping up......
Thursday September 13th 2007 08:10:09 PM
wheesht: not available just yet.sent out a few test copies to get feedback on the remastering.should be out before the end of the year.
Thursday September 13th 2007 07:21:25 PM
aspendrift: Are these albums now available to buy, if so where?
Thursday September 13th 2007 03:44:55 AM
a hundred pleats: Don't get me started with ITW... The simple and touching magnificence of the heart's purity,well- traveled through voices,sounds,instruments,landscapes of noise,silent moments,life... to finally rest under the warm and comforting glow of a journey fulfilled.
Wednesday September 12th 2007 07:29:29 PM
pufff: ...as does In This World. Truly beautiful...
Wednesday September 12th 2007 09:56:34 AM
water dragon chant: The remastered version of Camouflage Heart sounds wicked... ;-)
Tuesday September 04th 2007 03:38:55 AM | [ link ]
Song of Hawthorn: CINdYTALK LIVE !!! BEHIND BARS V,29 Sep 2007, 22:00 Ben Jonson Rd. Stepney Green, London, London and South East E1 3NH.Cost : ’3-5.Supporting: The next QueerBeograd festival & Anarchists Against the Wall (AATW).
Friday August 31st 2007 05:14:13 AM
wedge of cranes: From Isolation Recordings: 20 August 2007, Cindytalk release date. We've been receiving quite a lot of requests for information on the release date of Up Here In the Clouds by Cindytalk. No release date yet, but once we have one, it will be posted on the site. We've also started a mailing list for info on the release. Email us at info@isolationrecordings.com with the header Cindytalk and we can add you to the list and email you once a date is finalised.
Sunday August 26th 2007 11:57:08 AM | [ link ]
electric sheep: transgender warrior ? transgender warrior !
Friday August 17th 2007 01:36:44 PM
cndr: thanks for posting that,i've had a fucker of a week and would have undoubtedly missed it otherwise.cheers...
Friday August 17th 2007 09:47:19 AM | [ link ]
Enduring power of the people: Pilger's "The War on Democracy",article in today's The Guardian.
Friday August 17th 2007 09:40:40 AM | [ link ]
Enduring power of the people: Pilger's "The War on Democracy",article in today's The Guardian.
Wednesday August 15th 2007 04:18:27 AM | [ link ]
what_did_the_lady_forget...: From Isolation Recordings website: For its first CD release of the year, Isolation is delighted to announce that this will be Up Here In The Clouds by Cindytalk. Up Here In The Clouds is a laptop set by Cindytalk, who for the past 25 years have been beguiling and challenging listeners with their beautiful, uncompromising sound. The album will be released in a limited edition of 500.
Tuesday August 14th 2007 02:19:52 PM | [ link ]
coterie again: I do hate links here . . .
Tuesday August 14th 2007 02:19:09 PM | [ link ]
coterie: A new cindytalk track is available for listening at Isolation Recordings's myspace!
Tuesday August 14th 2007 11:15:10 AM
fat boab: i'm not looking,i'm not looking...
Tuesday August 14th 2007 06:05:17 AM | [ link ]
sofa&bed: Well,click on "ethereal" and you're transported to the entry for Dark Wave!
Tuesday August 14th 2007 12:33:38 AM
oor wullie: i was referring to "ethereal" and "ambient".help,it's all gone wrong...
Monday August 13th 2007 10:32:12 PM
pufff: well i never! Bass is the same in German as it is in English. You learn something new every day. :-)
Monday August 13th 2007 10:25:35 AM
jingscrivvensundhelpmaboab: holy fucking moly!!!
Monday August 13th 2007 09:50:38 AM | [ link ]
bed&sofa: wikiPOWER! There is now a cindytalk entry in German!!!
Sunday July 29th 2007 10:31:06 PM
iawwh: cheers fir that. much needed. "he comes to our aid in what we are living today". so does cindytalk.
Saturday July 28th 2007 01:18:16 PM | [ link ]
circle of shit: An angel’s rage By John Berger....... If I say he [Pier Paolo Pasolini] was like an angel, I can’t imagine anything more stupid being said about him. An angel painted by Cosimo Tura? No. There’s a St George by Tura which is his speaking likeness! He abhorred official saints and beatific angels. So why say it? Because his habitual and immense sadness allowed him to share jokes, and the look on his distressed face distributed laughter, guessing exactly who needed it most. And the more intimate his touch, the more lucid it became! He could whisper to people softly about the worst that was happening to them and they somehow suffered a little less, “for we never have despair without some small hope” (full essay at link)
Saturday July 21st 2007 04:29:54 AM | [ link ]
spaewaif: Well,this link...
Saturday July 21st 2007 04:29:20 AM | [ link ]
spaewaif: "No more heroes",a recently published book,features an entry for The Freeze.Follow the link to read it.
Tuesday July 17th 2007 11:02:23 AM
cndr: iwan,as i sead before,eternally grateful.both spaewaif and i had tried unsuccessfully to use the myspace piece for wikipedia but couldn't get it accepted.your diligence and superior knowledge of how to work with that particular system has paid off.in fact,i think i even wrote the original article for wikipedia but couldn't get it to work so diverted it to myspace.the moral i took from my efforts was that the artist has no place writing their own biographies... cheers for the help.much appreciated.
Tuesday July 17th 2007 07:50:07 AM
The Hearing Forest: It was a bitch to put up, because starting with a tiny article and extend later is almost impossible with wikipedia. so I decided to 'nick' the myspace story. If you see any errors (members/former members?), feel free to change or let me know. I'll see if I can add some more, a URL to touchedRadio should also be there I guess. It may make Cindytalk easier to 'find', now the only thing we need are some releases :)
Tuesday July 17th 2007 02:26:34 AM
pillowbook: Great! tried myself a hundred times unsuccesfully.Nice to finally have it there.
Monday July 16th 2007 08:11:58 PM
cndr: eternally grateful to whoever did this.thankyou.
Monday July 16th 2007 02:41:19 PM
Lady Luncheatin: nice1
Monday July 16th 2007 01:00:50 PM | [ link ]
Baron Münchhausen: There are a few cindypedia pages now.
Wednesday June 27th 2007 12:50:03 PM
oh dear...: considering it comes from a book entitled "the theatre and it's double",it would be difficult to forget what it is referring to but it would certainly be short-sighted not to see that it could refer to other situations and scenarios in life as well."ideas have wings and can fly"...
Wednesday June 27th 2007 12:15:39 PM
Heliogabale: It is often forgotten that Artaud was referring to actors and audience with this quote,but especially actors...
Wednesday June 27th 2007 11:32:35 AM
the crackle of my soul: And if there is still one hellish, truly accursed thing in our time, it is our artistic dallying with forms, instead of being like victims burnt at the stake, signalling through the flames. -- Antonin Artaud
Wednesday June 27th 2007 09:50:59 AM
cndr: cindytalk has always been based on ideas,not "sales","marketing strategies","royalties","formats", whatever... it matters little how the "industry" changes,.what really counts is the collision of ideas and the struggle to shape them in interesting ways.
Wednesday June 27th 2007 09:46:50 AM | [ link ]
variation: And in some three years time,mobile phones and digital music...
Wednesday June 27th 2007 09:43:41 AM | [ link ]
apollon: iTunes is now the third-largest music retailer in the US.
Wednesday June 27th 2007 09:41:14 AM | [ link ]
terpsichore: Obsolete CDs? Sales soon down by 20%...
Tuesday June 26th 2007 02:56:53 PM
soulseek: i wasn't saying soulseek gave donations to artists (though i believe they do release records of independent artists who are part of the network), rather that as individuals we could take it upon ourselves to donate directly to the artists we respect if we are freely downloading their work. it's incredibly hard work. and artists like cindytalk need support if we want to keep hearing their miraculous sounds.
Monday June 25th 2007 09:52:51 PM
Walter Trobisch: For what it's worth. Previous posts had touched on the plight of musicians not getting their fair dues. The reference to Adam and Eve clumsily alludes to the fact it's been this way for a long time. The linked cartoon is a mediocre and lazy tribute to the famous Sunday Times cartoon of "snouts in the trough" and the song chosen is a personal nod to Freddie Mercury's passionate and emotional blast at the system. As a posting, intellectually inadequate, as a sentiment, well meant.
Monday June 25th 2007 03:40:57 PM
Cornelius Buttercup III: No. I think you pretty much hit the nail on the head with your very astute observation.
Monday June 25th 2007 02:59:16 PM
Jon : dude,If there's any actual point to that last posting other than drawing attention to yourself and your half-assed sense of humor,please let us know?
Monday June 25th 2007 12:55:33 PM | [ link ]
Cornelius Buttercup III: I've got a recording somewhere of Adam playing drums to Eve with a whale bone and a few rocks. The snake sold it to Rubblestone Records for a tidy sum but I downloaded it free off Limewire.
Monday June 25th 2007 09:21:59 AM | [ link ]
calliope: Another Sharp-iTunes related info would be 4AD's exclusive iTunes release,"Full of Dust and Guitars" EP,which includes a crispy 'Sixteen Days / Gathering Dust' 12" version,never released on CD.
Monday June 25th 2007 09:09:51 AM | [ link ]
calliope: Another Sharp-iTunes related info would be 4AD's exclusive iTunes release,"Full of Dust and Guitars" EP,which includes a crispy 'Sixteen Days / Gathering Dust' 12" version,never released on CD.
Monday June 25th 2007 08:54:31 AM | [ link ]
polymnie: "Splinter and Move" has been in the Ghosts player for quite a while.It is available in iTunes -I bought it for some 110 yen or-though I've got three vinyl copies of it!-I was surprised to see it there but as has been explained here,Cherry Red seem to own the track so all my yen went to them.Regarding money from Soulseek going to the artists,does it really happen?
Sunday June 24th 2007 11:32:44 PM
cndr: no,napster have NO DEAL with cindytalk,no connection at all."splinter and move" should belong to us as we bought our entire repertoire of songs from the nat west bank after midnight music went into liquidation but it seems that it wriggled away and ended up with cherry red who re-issued the original midnight music compilation.so i'm guessing that any monies will go to cherry red directly.we have had absolutely no communication with them or napster at all.
Sunday June 24th 2007 11:20:26 PM
Lost Soul: Quite right, I have used soulseek in that past and I particularly liked the browse users files option. I also got some good tracks by contacting a few users. Maybe I'm getting old but I do kinda like the legitamacy of Napster and in theory the artist will get paid when you download their songs. Maybe we'll know soon because I got 4 people to download Splinter And Move so let's see if Napster send cindytalk some money.
Sunday June 24th 2007 09:20:46 PM | [ link ]
soulseek: or just have a sniff around this... community based, donation supported, commercial-free music sharing. cindytalk catalogue to be found several times over.and if you feel inclined maybe you should support cindytalk for the wonderous music you find there and find a way donate to them directly.
Saturday June 23rd 2007 09:33:24 PM
Nap Ster: And finally - thank goodness I hear you say - "Napster are working hard to add more of their (cindytalk's) music."
Saturday June 23rd 2007 09:28:43 PM
Tony Day: ...and according to Napster, if I like cindytalk, I will also like:- Casper Salcedo, Larry Swartwood, Alien Christ, PAN, Cindy Nelson, Ceiling Star, Webb Wilder, Autumn's Descent, Sweet Japonic, CyberHum, Dave Hedeman, 3milehigh, Kip Winger, Brian Saint and The Sinners, IDLEMINE, Jonathan David Steinhoff, SILIKON, Blue Root, Honey Child and finally Ernest Goodlife Band. This is great because I've never heard of any of them and obviously they are all out there for my pleasure. By the way, cindytalk were influenced by Cabaret Voltaire and Throbbing Gristle, THAT'S ACCORDING TO NAPSTER BEFORE YOU START.
Saturday June 23rd 2007 07:57:32 PM
The Optomist: Every time I log into Napster the first search I do is cindytalk. Two years of no rsults but never one to give up I did my usual search tonight and low and behold I got a result. Cndytalk - Splinter and Move [Album] - Between Today and Tomorrow. I immediately hit the download button putting the track in my queue behind 150 Top Ten Hits by Simon and Garfunkel. And now I have it in all it glory, Splinter and Move the song which makes you look stupid on the dancefloor by leaving you mid pretzel with no more music. Not interested enough eh! Ha!
Thursday June 14th 2007 09:39:45 AM | [ link ]
cndr: well for starters,i think if you google cindytalk it still comes up as cindytalk.org.how do we go about getting the .com as the main destination?
Thursday June 14th 2007 09:12:57 AM
Cautiously Yearning: Aye, but the engines are on idle skipper. Gimme something to do.
Wednesday June 13th 2007 10:55:46 PM
huffypants: that was a tantrum!!?shite,if i'd known i'd have at least got a few more personal insults in... get back to the engine room ye effing toerag!!!
Wednesday June 13th 2007 07:55:04 PM
touched (a): Perfectly true and cindytalk becomes a part of us and because we feel we connect we each bring a little piece of ourselves to cindytalk, wanted and unwanted, abstract and analytical, loved and loathed, beautiful and ugly, we give what we have.
Wednesday June 13th 2007 07:11:13 PM
touched (c): I can only imagine that people lurking or contributing to this forum are honestly interested in the works of Cindytalk. Some people obviously are more personally involved than others, but essentially there's nothing but a heartfelt interest in all that is Cindytalk.
Wednesday June 13th 2007 04:55:01 PM
PO: How disappointing. In the past I have always found your tantrums educational, guiding and constructive. But here for the only time I can ever recall you have descended to the "my dad's bigger than your dad." level or argument. Let me be the one for once to raise the level of debate by making the following points. I am no more than an admirer of cindytalk, I'm not in any way connected to what the band represents or the spirit of cindytalk, therefore if I decide to personally have an interest in who else listens and where they listen from and if I choose to share that information on an open forum then I should not be accused of tarnishing the image, spirit or essence of cindytalk. If anyone allows something I have written to diminish their view of cindytalk then they are missing the point. The suggestion that I don't find cindytalk interesting enough is ridiculous. I play at least one cindytalk set or album every day of every week (I play Freeze music maybe once a month). So if I decide to scrape around for more cindytalk inputs into my life and even if those inputs are pretty sad in your opinion then I think I can allow myself that luxury and I think you should too. I can understand why you and probably anyone else in the forum or blog would take the view that I keep lurching back to the Freeze. Try to use a little bit of that vast brain of yours and figure it out. I do this on forums where contributions are made in writing because I am confident when sharing information and memories relating to the Freeze based on the fact that a lot of the time I was there and I saw it happen. My memory is sometimes innacurate but that is a human failing and not a vindictive plot to misinform. I make very few written contributions to cindytalk discussions because I am not involved in any way that would make my contributions valid, meaningful or interesting. As far as cindytalk recordings and ideas are concerned, I listen, I like but I don't necessarily understand. Here's what we should do, you continue your creative process and I'll decide how to receive cindytalk into my life and how I make the whole experience work for me.
Wednesday June 13th 2007 10:04:19 AM
cndr: no,it's a free speaking forum.i just think that statistics and/or business is against the spirit of cindytalk.it also kind of implies that the ideas and the music are not quite interesting enough for you.is that why we keep lurching back 28years to the freeze as well?
Tuesday June 12th 2007 09:16:12 PM
Engine Room: Mmm. So stats is off the agenda then. Fair enough.
Tuesday June 12th 2007 07:10:04 PM
cndr: i have consistently ignored all your attempts to lower the tone of cindytalk with statistics,i had no desire to give oxygen to such a dull subject.cheers for bringing it here...
Tuesday June 12th 2007 08:32:26 AM | [ link ]
spaewaif: There are various blogs in Latinamerica,most of them associated with radio or internet radio programmes,that contain references to Cindytalk or Gordon Sharp/This Mortal Coil.Most of them also offer downloads of the bands they feature,including whole album recordings or live gigs! Examples are 32puertas,Acto de Fe (in Venezuela) and Argentinian oceanico71, among many others. It might well be that the countries in that region are now getting a greater amount of exposure to certain kinds of music,mostly from the past,to which access might have been difficult until now and are looking for related artists and then enjoying what they hear. Interestingly,I read in aceanico71 that some This Mortal Coil related musicians are also touring Argentina and Peru this very month.
Tuesday June 12th 2007 07:43:04 AM
bewogen beweging: ER... one figure that would be important is the number of unique 'listeners'. And the nice little release should be FPE (original or as DJ Mix), I'm willing to sponsor.
Tuesday June 12th 2007 06:28:46 AM
spaewaif: Engine Room,I find all that information irresistibly fascinating! An idea for a Ghosts post...(when I bloody find the time to do so!) Thank you very much!!!
Monday June 11th 2007 11:19:14 PM
Engine Room: In case anyone hasn't figured it out yet, yes I am incredibly boring, sad and lonely. But I can see that 956 people from 7 different countries have listened to touchdRADIO in the first 11 days of June. Me and Joe (he's my invisible friend) write to all these people and send them photos and stuff, but no one has ever written back yet.
Monday June 11th 2007 11:00:44 PM
Engine Room: I'm sure thast last post opened the door for a bit of Argentine analysis so here it is. Of the 33 Argentine listeners here's what they played. tochedRAWKISSEDsour (33), FireyPlanetEyes (9), After The Fireflies (3), Up Here In The Clouds (2), DJ Fatal (2) and The Freeze (0). Deduction - don't make that "nice little release" The Freeze, they just don't want it. Going on bandwidth figures they gave up on Up Here In The Clouds halfway through - the fools, but the rest of the channels played were given a full hearing by everyone for the most part. For some reason the stats don't tell me what proportion of listeners were boys and what proportion were girls so I'll need to work on that.
Monday June 11th 2007 07:50:14 PM
moved movement: looking at those numbers (Argentina???) I guess a nice little release would be warranted
Monday June 11th 2007 05:59:02 PM
Engine Room: Hmmm. Not enough statistical analysis then, I'll work the numbers again.
Monday June 11th 2007 04:25:50 PM
observation tower: hey engine room. i saw derren brown on telly last night and he has this thing where he gets someone to slap him upside the head so he can speed count things. maybe something similar can be arranged for you.
Monday June 11th 2007 10:36:33 AM
Engine Room: In case anyone out there likes numbers as I do (and as cinder doesn't) here are some numbers prompted by the previous post. In France last month 39 people tuned into touchedRADIO which makes France 6th on the list. If anyone is still reading this, here's the top ten listening countries, I'll do it backwards like on the radio. 10 Portugal (30), 9 Argentina (33), 8 Spain (35), 7 Netherlands (38), 6 France (39), 5 Italy 133, 4 Germany (149), 3 Japan (172), 2 Great Britain (344) and number 1 USA (564). Well I really enjoyed that, I will maybe do it more often unless some grumpy person stops me. I'll need to work on the presentation a bit because I'm no Terry Wogan, thank goodness.
Saturday June 09th 2007 01:15:44 PM | [ link ]
mogari-no-mori: French webzine Trinity features a new version of their old Cindytalk page.
Thursday June 07th 2007 12:38:03 AM
p.s.: it was third song in on the live set that was just taken down from touchedRADIO.it'll go back up in time i'm sure,you'll just have to keep checking in to see if it's there...
Thursday June 07th 2007 12:36:43 AM
cndr: yup,"camera code" was a freeze song circa 1980/1981.
Wednesday June 06th 2007 03:35:55 PM
before herstory is left behind: is "camera code" a freeze track? is there a recording exisitng of it? it's an interesting title...
Wednesday June 06th 2007 03:32:29 PM
PO: and cindytalk?
Wednesday June 06th 2007 12:51:51 AM
andy revere: "the clock in the distance shows midnight tonight as the haze falls into the town..." that scene was set walking along the canal banks returning from preston road late at night... so yes, "sunday" was absolutely inspired by the mood of growing up in linlithgow.that church spire,the palace and the loch...questions regarding religion in scotland,the certainty of faith... the song finishes with the line.. "we followed the tracks of our shoes"....
Tuesday June 05th 2007 10:14:06 PM
PO: Oh, sorry for staying nostalgic but once you've answered the Linlithgow question I'll let you get back to future thoughts for a while.
Tuesday June 05th 2007 09:43:24 PM
PO: When I was a kid in Linlithgow I had the toughest paper round going. I had to walk all the way up Manse Road, past Clarendon (where the posh kids who didn't have to work lived) until I got up to Laverock Park. Then it was all down hill emptying my bag as I went through all the Friars, Way, Brae, Loan etc. I remember cold Sunday mornings walking down the hill as my bag got lighter and the church bells at St Michaels would start tolling. A while after this the Freeze song Sunday came along and it always put me in mind of the moment the bells started, it still does. So my very long winded question is this, are there any Freeze songs inspired by the town of Linlithgow? I can't think of any but as three quarters of the band (referring to the classic line up here) came from the town I think some inspiration must have shone through somewhere.
Tuesday June 05th 2007 12:05:45 PM
"& breezes rustle in the trees: Old sounds,new sounds,anything!! We want them. . . NOW!
Tuesday June 05th 2007 12:41:40 AM
cndr: thinking back on it,camera code might well have been the fourth choice.would love to have had a peel recording of that one.hmmm... if i had a bunch of applicable musicians today and if we had loads of studio time etc it'd be fun to play with some of those songs,record them with a new twist.but i'm dreaming, loitering around nostalgia and that is bad for the soul, i'd sooner emerse myself in new sounds than old...
Monday June 04th 2007 11:40:52 PM
Hercules Hutchinson: Let me see, Hollow is the obvious guess but it would not have existed then so I'm guessing track 4 would have been Camera Code.
Monday June 04th 2007 11:39:07 PM
Robert Johnson: Only recorded 3? Nice one, the old missing track ploy, and of course you will never tell us what that 4th track would have been.
Monday June 04th 2007 11:34:45 PM
Kaiser Soeze: Maybe while some very ordinary bands recorded too much, too often, too blandly, The Freeze recorded too little and that's kinder to the memory.
Monday June 04th 2007 09:39:14 PM
cndr: i was thinking mainly of the two 7inch's and although we did learn a lot from the peel sessions but they are by their nature quick stops in the studio... one day sessions to record 4 songs - we took so long on the second session we only managed 3!!! that's what i mean,we took too long to adjust to these settings.we were always destined to use the studio as a playground of discovery rather than a quick visit to record well rehearsed songs.to our detriment that's an expensive style/fault to have.we tried on many occasions to get the bbc to release our peel session tapes but were always fobbed off until eventually they claimed they had been destroyed.the bbc were notorious for destroying audio and visual documents so there's no reason to doubt that although periodically we ask again.but i think we have lost them for good.there must be someone out there with cleaner cassette copoes of these songs than i have,surely!!?
Monday June 04th 2007 05:58:23 PM
PO: There should be 7 very well recorded songs though, the John Peel sessions. I do not suggest that these are poorly recorded or mixed, because I think they are great. The problem is I have only heard very hissy versions and versions where the hiss has been removed only to be replaced by a slight metalic sound. Do you have access to the clean masters from these sessions, or do the Beeb own them? The 'live band' comment is bang on I think. I would not understand what makes a live band as opposed to a studio band but I think the Freeze did enjoy the best audiences of the era, do you think maybe the band connected with that energy? Bit of a chicken and egg question I suppose.
Monday June 04th 2007 05:24:04 PM
cndr: i was thinking about that management situation when i was writing about the freeze not adjusting well to the studio... the production of both freeze singles was "handled" by our "management team" and looking back now i think they had even less idea of how to utilise a studio than we did.we were definately a wee bitty naive.i recall trying to get a producer in for the celebratiuon/crossover 7inch (pete holidai from the radiators from space offered his services for a small fee) but was told we had no more money for that. it was a huge mistake,we would have learnt so much from having someone helping us to maximise our ideas and our sound.
Monday June 04th 2007 03:42:52 PM
PO: Interesting to hear these thoughts. It really is a shame the Freeze did not release an album towards the end but obviously many good things came out of that as you have just mentioned. It's ironic that the Freeze had a management structure (of sorts) whereas cindytalk didn't don't as such. Obviously lesson one was, keep control solely within the grasp of those connected musically and leave the clipboard brigade out of it.
Monday June 04th 2007 03:07:48 PM
cndr: it never ceases to amaze me either... we had very little support and were not one of the chosen bands of that time.we were good,worked hard and had a sizeable following but we never really fitted in with the "scene" in edinburgh or scotland at that time.sometimes that's all that matters,fitting in.and we didn't.7 years in scotland and not much to show for it,name change to cindytalk moved to london and 6 months later a record contract and a budget to record "camouflage heart".and that was without a full band line-up so no possible gigs!the freeze were a live band ready,willing and very able to play pretty much anywhere.doesn't make much sense.of course as sods law would have it when we started meeting record company types in london they often said had they heard the freeze at the time they were active they would have signed us immediately and that includes ivo at 4ad!!! so we obviously weren't good at getting our music to the right people who in turn clearly weren't listening to john peel the nights we were on.also,in truth,i've never been much of a networker so i wasn't out handing demo tapes to all and sundry at gigs and/or clubs etc....there are rules to this game and if you're like me and can't be arsed playing along you'll inevitably pay the price.why weren't the freeze recordings handled well... hmmm not sure i just don't think were at that time very good at using the studio as an instrument,it took time to learn.david was good with sound but he never seemed to step up and take control of that and i have never been technical or even a musician in the traditional sesnse so my learning curve was a bit deeper.by the time i was thinking of the change to cindytalk i was starting to know what it was i was looking for artistically.it's sad that the freeze never got to explore their sound more but i'm also glad that those energies were held back for the cindytalk recordings,it certainly helped to intensify them.
Monday June 04th 2007 02:03:10 PM
MK taxi: Why weren't the 7" or the Peel Sessions "handled well"? Also,it never ceases to amaze me why The Freeze never recorded an album,considering how extensively you toured and the large repertoire of songs!
Monday June 04th 2007 12:32:34 PM
cndr: i don't think it occured to us to do a single or e.p. release before "camouflage heart",our only intention was to make an album as good and as quick as we could.that might have been because the freeze were never able to record one (i thought we hadn't handled our recordings - 7"'s & peel sessions - very well) so i was totally focused on CH.those early cindytalk tracks on "quietly burning" were the demos for CH but we felt that only "everybody is christ" was the only recording good enough to sit alongside the studio recordings.personally i think "love comes in from nowhere","teach me to whisper" and "splinter and move" were,in essence,good enough for CH but there were aspects of the recordings that made me feel uncomfortable so we passed them by.considering our recording facilities were fairly primitive,david did a brilliant job with "everybody is christ".another thing,with all 4 of those improvisational demos,we had caught them nearly perfectly,performance- wise,it's nearly impossible to capture that again so re-approaching them was difficult.i'm sure we tried.we re-approached "everybody is christ" in the studio but it never felt as right as the demo.
Sunday June 03rd 2007 10:21:26 PM
PO: Why were the 4 session tracks (5 if you count Everybody Is Christ) not recorded in the studio when the album was recorded? I imagine the answer is along the lines of "time is money", especially studio time. I think there was a great pre Camouflage Heart E.P. trying to break out here.
Sunday June 03rd 2007 07:33:07 AM | [ link ]
Kushi-Katsu: The Peel Sessions "Quietly Burning" set is up again. With it,some Cindytalk tracks from the demo sessions for Camouflage Heart as opposed to the actual studio sessions.These are the same sessions that "Everybody is Christ" came from,though that was the only demo used on the actual album. Enjoy!
Wednesday May 30th 2007 11:06:06 AM
Jam